After finishing a Bachelor in Music Performance at the Victorian College Of Arts, Melbourne muso Ned Collette set about gathering a disparate crew of similarly trained musicians under the name City City City, who after releasing two records of dense art-rock called it quits. Collette soon reappeared performing deeply impressive solo sets armed with nothing but a loop pedal, a Gibson SG and his voice, creating complex, layered arrangements to back up his literary slant.

Such a period led to a largely self-recorded debut solo album Jokes & Trials, which was released on Dot Dash Records in 2006, and found Collette being invited to perform through Europe at the behest of Joanna Newsom. Upon return, Collette roped in City City City's Joe Talia and Ben Burke on drum and bass duties respectively, leading to the 'Ned Collette Band' moniker being adopted around the time of Collette's 2007 follow up Future Suture. The regrouped trio set off on a European tour through 2008, and whilst stationed there in Glasgow, Collette found seed for a third record, as well as a newly solidified relationship with Burke and Talia that would result in the pairing becoming known as Wirewalker.

Ned Collette & Wirewalker's third album Over The Stones & Under The Stars, released October 2009, is a lively, richly rewarding album that doesn't so much snub current trends as operate in a world where no such divisions exist. Or as our reviewer Ben Gook more eloquently put it: "Ned Collette and Wirewalker want to show you a good time, but they don't want to treat you like an idiot to get there. Hooks, guitar solos and other good things about rock'n'roll exist in the same space as searing critiques of our modern world, hope with exhaustion, angst with belief, fear with relief."

Having known Collette since his City City City days, our conversation rambled through the process of building a band, decamping to Berlin, inheriting a member of Augie March and how the Beatles were kind've good.

Ned Collette & Wirewalker finish their launch tour this Friday 27th Nov in Melbourne at the Northcote Social Club.

--

It seems like you're getting good at churning out records fairly quick? Going away, gestating, and then when it comes to recording, banging it out.

There was a bit of messing around at first [with this one]. We had a bit of a false start where we recorded what we thought was the album and then canned it later. But that was more to do with the songs themselves. Once we had the group of songs we felt really right about, it was really quick. We decided not to spend much time in the studio. We didn't want to layer it up too much. So a lot of it is live and then where there are overdubs they're really sparingly done.

The record still sounds like there's a lot going on.

Yeah I know, I know. It's just that we didn't do any of that 'let's double this guitar part with the same guitar part to make it sound bigger!'. 'Cause that never actually works, I think it makes it sound more diffused. So, there's definitely a couple of tracks that were built up a bit more in the traditional sense. At least half of them went down pretty much live. And I think four of the vocals are live as well.

Do you have the fantasy of actually doing a live record?

Yeah I think we get a bit closer each time. I think we got pretty close with this one. It would be cool to set those limitations - absolutely no overdubs whatsoever and you just wait until you've got a good take. I think [as far as recording live goes] it is me holding the others back at the end of the day. Because I'm probably more insecure about my vocals than anyone else is about anything else, you know?

It's interesting how Joe (Talia, drummer and co-producer) isn't really into songwriter-y songs and is more into experimental music. And yet he still applies himself really well to the pop song construct.

Yeah he's awesome around songs, as a drummer. I don't think it's necessarily that he's not into songwriting - I mean if you look at songwriting in the broader sense of not just being in the domain of the singer/songwriter, but any sort've rock band - he's totally into that. It's more that he's not really into that Australian history of rock bands - except for AC/DC. He [just] won't play the obvious thing. And that's probably a by product of him not really understanding why you'd just make a song do exactly the same thing that everyone else has done with it. Which is a blessing. But he loves songs. He loves lyrical songs and he loves words. And that's why he's good at playing around a song. But he won't base that on anything but what the song presents, if you know what I mean. He won't go 'Well normally in a song like this - because I've listened to so much of this stuff - I'm just gonna play...blah' you know?

He does shape it though. We were actually listening to Ringo Starr the other day and talking about that stuff. Fuck he's really good!

Ringo?

Yeah! He's totally an amazing drummer. He was a great drummer. Anyway....we're getting....(laughs). Don't stop the press because I said the Beatles were good (laughs).

Ned Collette in 'Beatles were good' shock.

(Laughs).

It's interesting that with your music you do talk a lot about outside references. Especially with film, but also very specific musical references. Rather than just saying 'Oh I like the Beatles', it's a particular sound on a particular song. I get a sense almost, that the songs exist with the awareness of being songs.

Well when I'm writing the songs I don't think about other songs. Often I'll think about books. I don't think I'm ever writing a song and thinking 'Oh this sounds a bit like that, so I'll go for that'. Musically. But then sometimes we'll talk about it a bit later. 'Oh yeah, this has got a bit of the vibe of...blah'. And we do that a lot because we really enjoy that analytical aspect of music. But only after it's down. We tend not to talk about that beforehand because it can tend to weird things out.

Ned Collette & Wirewalker - 'Come Clean'

Is it the Ned Collette psyche filtered through those disparate elements?

Yeah I guess so. I would imagine that all art - one way or another -  uses elements of experience, whether it's other art or whether it's just day to day, what happens on the train. I would imagine that all good art represents the psyche of the artist. It's unavoidable. I never think 'I'm going to write a song about this - done'. It's all way too oblique unfortunately. I've never been able to sit down and write a song about that great thing that happened this morning. I'm hopeless at that. I just sort've fly around in a weird abstract world until I get enough that I can edit down into something.

Does that frustrate you?

It doesn't frustrate me, but I'm really wary of it. Because I don't like meandering meaningless songs. So, it's like I have to put myself on my guard. I like abstraction in writing but I think it needs to be made sense of, in some degree. But it's always different, sometimes a song will just pop out in five minutes. It's there, ready to go.

Describe the process from initially working with Ben and Joe in City City City, to having them play on your solo recordings, to becoming a fully fledged band.

I reckon City City City was the band that came out of me being in my early twenties and having studied music and wanting to do everything. 'I wanna sound simultaneously like Stereolab and AC/DC', you know? It was one of those things where you throw everything in and there's just too much. I reckon that happens to heaps of people. When they start out and they want to be everything and do everything. Or conversely they stick to one thing, at the other end of the spectrum. And I never really had that.

So when I went solo it was an attempt to find what was really at the core, or what was really interesting to me. And songs came out of that. But after a couple of years of doing that on my own, with all those loops and stuff, then I wanted a band because I had a much stronger idea of how to lead a band or exist in a band. Then after a couple of years of feeling like they were my backing band, it got to the point where I realised it was going to be much better if I just relinquished control over everything. Except the actual songwriting. And that's when it became Wirewalker. On the European tour we did about a year ago, it was 'Ok this is now it's own thing, it doesn't just feel like they're backing me up'. So it was all really natural and slow. They weren't really fussed whether we had a name. Or whether it was the Ned Collette band or whatever, until I came up with a name that they liked. And it just so happened to coincide with feeling like a proper band. It was cool.

Did you think about calling the band Wirewalker and dropping the Ned Collette?

Totally. We talked about that. I guess at the time I was still writing the material and coming in with the songs fully formed. And if [those guys] weren't there I'd still be playing these songs one way or another. Then there's that continuity for people who are interested in it. To go from City City City to Ned Collette to Wirewalker in the space of three or four years...I kind've wanted to stick at it. And you know I'll probably still make solo things that are just me. Then when [Joe, Ben and I] do records together it'll be like this. And then we've talked about making an instrumental record that would maybe just be a Wirewalker record. So it's fairly fluid. But hopefully if we do a couple more albums like this then people will just understand it, that it can be one or the other.

Was there a time when you were going to just put out an album of loops, back before the band happened?

Not really. The first record and a bit of the second record came out of that period. I think when it comes to recording loops you're better off multi-tracking them as far as the sound quality goes. They have a certain charm - well they're the only option in a way, in front of people and it doesn't matter so much - but when I tried recording loops it didn't give me much control over the sound. Once you start doing that, it's like 'Well I can't loop a bassoon, but I still want a bassoon in there'. (laughs).

That would've been something that would've been good to have when you toured, particularly overseas with people like Joanna Newsom where you were playing bigger halls and stuff. [That way] you can still be quite powerful and present in those instances.

It was great to be self-sufficient. It's funny, because I started doing that because I absolutely didn't want to be the guy with an acoustic guitar. I wanted some sort've broader sonic element to it. But now of course when I play solo I just want to play acoustic guitar. Which is hilarious. And shows how much I think of myself as a songwriter (laughs).

Maybe it says something that when you started you were playing with nine people on stage and it's taken you this long to get to you with an acoustic.

I was absolutely un-confident about words and vocals. Definitely. I think a lot of artists and musicians tend to simplify things when they get older. I've done a few of those shows, just on an acoustic guitar, and a couple of them get lost. But when they're good - it's pretty amazing to do that well.

The first year or two of our band - the Ned Collette band - the songs really went out the window. And I think I got a lot of people offside, the people that used to enjoy my solo shows. We got reviews saying I didn't need a band. And a whole lot of people said 'Oh I like it solo better because there's just a song'. Even Joe at one point, he came to a solo gig - after the band had been playing for a while - and he said 'there's this thing when you do it solo, it's really captivating'. But I think it just took us a while for the band to figure out how to do that. We did go through a phase of trying to be a pretty loud rock band. And it was pretty....average. (laughs).

There's still some pretty loud stuff on the new record.

Yeah but most of the loudness comes when there aren't words going on. It's not like we even planned that to happen. I think that me as a guitarist - and I kind've think of the guitar playing and vocals on this record as being really separate - but I've had to learn to not play over my words. Everyone has. So it's become this default setting of like 'Well if you can't hear the words then you're just stomping on your instruments'.


Ned Collette - 'A Country With A Smile' live on RockWiz
 
Have you felt like you've had to dumb down your guitar playing a little bit?

I've had to simplify it, yeah totally. Around the words. I wouldn't say dumbed down because I find that element of intellectualising music really problematic. Like if you're playing lots of notes and complex stuff, how that makes it 'more intelligent'. So dumbed down isn't the words I'd use but I've definitely simplified it. And I also get a lot more pleasure out of simple things.

It can be pretty exciting to have both elements sit side by side as well. I like it when I see a super basic song but there's - for example - an incredibly technical solo in the middle of it.

Yeah that stuff's awesome. If it's done well, and a certain sortve...playfulness or joy rather than technical show off. Dan Luscombe (The Drones) came to our show in Sydney on the weekend and there's some songs with three part harmonies and stuff. He said afterwards 'Those three part harmonies were really great. And I really loved it that they only happened once or twice'. You could really bombard people with that if you're capable of doing it. But it takes the angles out of music if you pick the best bit, and then just hammer it home endlessly.

It makes you think they've actually made a decision. That's the cool thing, and that's where I think the big argument for really learning your craft, wins. Just because you know how how to do a lot of stuff, it absolutely doesn't mean you should do it. But if you do have access to it, it means you can when it's going to make a difference.

Do you want to outline the next few months? And talk about Adam Donovan (Augie March) joining the band?

We finish our album launch tour this weekend. I move to Berlin towards the end of March, at least until the end of next year. And I'm giving it six weeks before the next [European] band tour which is slated for May. I think Joe's planning on spending a fair bit of time over that way next year, but more in Italy. But Ben can't come on that tour because it's right when he's having his first kid. So it was panic stations for a little bit, but then Adam offered to do it, which is great.

Joe and I were going through people - I mean it's fine, it wasn't like 'No Ben you must come to Europe and go on a Ned Collette tour, instead of being at home for your first born' (laughs). We totally understood, but we did spend a few days going through the options. Like, 'do we find a good bass player? Or do we find a friend?' We started going through guitarists that could play bass. The thing that really scared me, even if they were good and could pick it up, we might not know [them very] well. Those social situations make me feel really awkward, it might be terrible. So we were going through possible people, but we hadn't actually asked anyone. And then there were all the people that you know are good, but really busy all the time.

And then before we had to think about it Adam just said 'Man, I'll do it'. In fact he said 'I really want to do it', you know, 'let me do it'. I mean I already knew Adam was moving to Berlin as well, and we were sort've talking about how it'd be fun and stuff. So for him to say 'I'd love to do it', it was just such a load off. 'Cause we're really great friends and I know what he's like. He's a known quanitity - he's a known quantity at the pub, I've seen him play - so hopefully there aren't too many surprises.

The thing I like too is that he really likes our band and has done for a long time. And he really liked Ben's playing and he really respects it. So it's not like 'Yeah I'll cover that shit', it's like 'Wow, that's kind've hard'. He knows Ben's really unique. There's a lot of spontenaity in Ben's playing, more than any of us he's the guy that will throw in bits on gigs or we'll record one take and it's this way, and another take and it's that way. So I think Dono understands that it's a tough thing.

I asked him how his singing was and he said it was 'brilliant'. (laughs). But I suspect we've got quite different voices, Ben's got quite a soft, round sound which balances well with me because my voice is quite harsh. So it'll be interesting and I'm not really worried about it. It'll be sad that Ben won't be there, cause I love playing with him. But it's the best of a weird situation.

Marcus

--

myspace.com/nedcollette